Boost Vitamin D Production, Mood & Circadian Rhythm with Full-Spectrum Light

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:00:00]:
Avoiding the sun is as dangerous as smoking.

Nick Urban [00:00:04]:
You’re listening to High Performance Longevity. The show exploring a better path to optimal health for those daring to live as an outlier in a world of averages. I’m your host, Nick Urban, bioharmonizer, performance coach, and lifelong student of both modern science and ancestral wisdom. Each week we decode the tools, tactics and timeless principles to help you optimize your mind, body and performance span. Things you won’t find on Google or in your AI tool of choice. From cutting edge biohacks to grounded lifestyle practices, you’ll walk away with actionable insights to look, feel, and perform at your best across all of life’s domains. Guti, welcome to the podcast.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:00:56]:
Thank you, Nick. Nice to be here.

Nick Urban [00:00:58]:
Yeah. So I’m going to set the stage for listeners. A long time ago, I was looking into light therapy products and specifically products designed to mimic sunlight. And a lot of the light therapy products in the market today contain one, two, maybe a couple wavelengths of different light, light spectrums like, for example, red and infrared. But they were all missing one of the core crucial components of sunlight that is paramount to a lot of the benefits that we associate with sunlight exposure. And that is ultraviolet light and specifically uvb. I came across a product a long time ago that used fluorescent bulbs. And it was expensive.

Nick Urban [00:01:42]:
And I didn’t like the other consequences of using fluorescent bulbs. They were the only ones, as far as I could tell, for a long time to do that. And I figured at some point someone would modernize that whole field. I thought about building my own. Then I realized playing with UVB and uva. But UVB in this case is risky. You have to actually know what you’re doing. And then I came across you guys at Mitolux, I want to say, about a year ago or so.

Nick Urban [00:02:10]:
And I was surprised and glad that finally there was an option on a market that better replicates sunlight. Yeah.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:02:20]:
It’s already been one year and a half since we started selling our products. And right now we have the second generation of the first lamp and also a second version that’s more affordable.

Nick Urban [00:02:32]:
Yeah. Walk me through your story. How did you get involved in light before we go on to what it is that your technology has and how it’s better able to mimic sunlight than any others.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:02:43]:
Okay. Well, basically right now I’m 48 years old. So I was raised during the 80s and during the 90s. And in my generation, you were taught to stay away from the sun. The sun is bad for you. Put a lot of sunscreen. So that’s the way I was raised. So I was always putting a lot of sunscreen.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:03:03]:
Many of those, the chemicals and those sunscreens are now banned because they found that they were actually doing more harm than good. So if you look at a picture of me just seven years ago, I. I was like super pale because I almost always avoided sunlight. Then during the last 20 years, I devoted myself as a photographer. So basically I was working with light, not for health issues, but just as recording. But I studied and actually I did 17 books on photography. So I have a lot of passion for light. But I didn’t have any clue that sunlight could be so incredible for health.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:03:44]:
For me, sunlight was just vitamin D, as most people do, and that was me. But five years ago, during the pandemic, I had a big divorce. It was not very nice. So I got depressed, my testosterone levels drop, and I had to go to the doctor. So I got trt. I got antidepressants, vitamin D and everything else. And it actually did a lot of good for me. That was the best decision back then.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:04:11]:
But two years later, I was still going with the trt, still going with the antidepressants. And I didn’t like the idea of having to be medicated the rest of my life because I was already doing good mentally, that it worked with something of my past. And the doctor said, you have to keep taking it. So I always love to do research. And I started looking like, what’s the best way to get your testosterone up naturally? What’s the best way to get your mood up naturally? And to my surprise, because I didn’t expect it was take sunbeds. Even better if you do naked sunbeds. So I said like, okay, I have already the sun because I live in El Salvador, so we have sun 90% of the year. And I started taking naked sunbeds.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:04:57]:
And so my surprise, from day number one, my mood was two or three times better. I was just so happy. And I said like, wow, day number one and already starting to feel this way. Also from day number two, I started to feel an increase in my libido. So only good things. I was feeling happier, higher energy, higher libido. And I started reading a lot of the books. So at the beginning, my focus was on sunlight to basically recover your circadian rhythm and also to get testosterone and also to improve the mood.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:05:34]:
So fast forward five months and I was out of trt, I was out of antidepressants, and I was feeling incredible. And basically the only medicine that I was taking there was optimizing my circadian rhythm, having a good night’s sleep, taking as much sunlight I could in my eyes and also on my skin. And that was my medicine and I couldn’t believe it. So that’s where the journey started. And how did I came with that idea to develop these products? Well, in El Salvador we had the rainy season and I was just used to getting my sunbeds. But I tried to buy a product that would combine naturally and mimic sunlight. That means the red and near infrared plus the UVs. And nobody was doing it.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:06:23]:
So at the beginning I bought a Spurtiland because it has a broad uva, UVB and did with by red light therapy. But I want a solution that could basically be better. So that’s how we started working and developing the Mitolux. Hmm.

Nick Urban [00:06:40]:
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And I like that you brought up that sunlight is about much more than just vitamin D production. It has a whole cascade of benefits from antimicrobial peptides to pro opioids that the body naturally produces and beta endorphins when exposed to the sun, which explains mood and all of the many, many therapeutic properties, which is a reason heliotherapy was commonly used treatment for a very long time. Do you know some of the other things that the sun does that the vitamin D supplements won’t necessarily?

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:07:15]:
Oh yes. For example, one of the ways that I started learning about how incredible sunlight is is testing it myself. Two years ago or around two and a half years ago, one of my dogs was almost non functional. The doctor said that if this continue we’ll have to put her to sleep because she was barely walking or because of age related arthritis. And I love my dog and I was already having a lot of devices that I bought. So I said, well I already believed that red light therapy was great for skin anti aging, but it was supposed to be incredible for arthritis. But I don’t have arthritis. So I just made a crate and put a red light therapy panel on the dog.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:08:01]:
And two weeks later she was running again because she naturally was seeking the the red near infrared and staying there for hours. And in two weeks the red near basically has gotten 90% of her arthritis and she was better than ever. And even the veterinarian couldn’t believe it. So one of the best ingredients in sunlight, it’s the red and most even more the near infrared because it can penetrate many inches deep. And I believe that the new scurvy of this generation is, is near infrared light deficiency. Infrared deficiency because if you’re not going out and you’re staying inside with the LEDs, you’re getting zero infrared, and your mitochondria need the infrared, or if not, they basically start shutting down. So that was one of the other things that I’ve learned. But sunlight, it’s incredible.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:08:58]:
It’s so many different pathways, and that’s just another one. The near infrared.

Nick Urban [00:09:04]:
I like that you mentioned that. And specifically LEDs, one of the ways they conserve energy is they strip out the frequencies that we can’t necessarily see with our eyes. And that’s how you save energy. But it comes at the cost of not having infrared light that you would otherwise get when exposed to original lighting sources like incandescents and then also halogens and. Or the sunlight. Yes.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:09:26]:
And actually, for example, I was super happy 18 years ago replacing all the incandescent lights in my house for LEDs. And that’s what I knew back then. Now I’m bringing back the incandescent back. So right now in my room, it’s 100% incandescent light, because I know that they’re less efficient, but they’re more healthy because 90% of their energy is turned to infrared. But that’s not wasted energy. That’s the energy my mitochondria needs. So that’s one of the changes that I’m doing. And actually, that’s why we.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:09:59]:
We added to the latest version of the Mitolux 1 program that’s called the fireplace. And basically, when you turn it on, I’m going to turn it right now, it’s giving you back the near infrared, that the modern lighting environment is totally depleted. So you can use it to get the infrared back to yourself. And it’s incredible when you see the before and after of how it can change your light environment. It’s amazing.

Nick Urban [00:10:28]:
Yeah. And that’s part of the reason that the light therapy panels that are typically just one wavelength of red light therapy, and then also one wavelength sometimes of near infrared light, the reason they’ve become so popular is that we now are not giving out on average for sunrise and sunset, those times of the day when red and infrared light are naturally most abundant. And then you fast forward a little later in the day, and then all of a sudden you have very low levels of those, and you have much higher levels of blue light combined with the blue light of technology, of devices. There’s a big deficiency in the diet of those particular, particular wavelengths. And that’s why when you add them back using technology or by being consistent with viewing the sunrise and sunset those times a day, Being outside and exposing your skin and eyes to those wavelengths, people have dramatic results. But I also like what you’re mentioning. Those aren’t the only wavelengths. And why not have a device that can toggle between all the different ones that we need as humans?

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:11:34]:
Yeah, so basically I realized in my journey that I don’t have to reinvent the ideal light. The perfect light is the sun. And basically with every generation we’re releasing, we are adding more wavelengths and trying to get more of the benefits of sunlight by trying to imitate natural sunlight as much as possible. So the ultimate goal would be to create a lamp that could mimic sunlight in all its different phases.

Nick Urban [00:12:03]:
Yeah, the so called purists will say that only a couple wavelengths of light are well studied. So things like the 660 nanometer red light, the 850 nanometer near infrared, 810 near infrared, a couple of different spectrums across the board, and those are the ones that devices should use. And anything else is a total waste. But if we actually look at natural light sources, there’s never been single isolated wavelengths like that, or even dual isolated wavelengths. It’s always a spectrum. And it seems to make a lot more sense that just because the research isn’t there yet, there’s not a lot of peer reviewed research on it. It doesn’t mean it doesn’t have benefits. It’s just we don’t know the benefits yet.

Nick Urban [00:12:40]:
And sure, over 10, the next 10 years, hopefully shorter, we’ll see that other wavelengths also have other unique benefits. And the best effect is when you combine multiple wavelengths into one therapeutic session.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:12:54]:
Oh yes, definitely. Because the first panels were basically 660 nanometer red, 850 nanometer near infrared. And obviously that’s better than not having any red and a near infrared by itself. But that doesn’t mean that those are the only wavelengths that give benefit. Right now there’s a lot of research that actually the best wavelength is not 660, but 670 and not 830, but 820. The 760 is amazing. So basically, in my opinion, the more wavelengths you have, the better curve you will have and the better you will mimic sunlight. So that’s why on our latest MITA locks, it’s seven wavelengths into a super small device.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:13:39]:
So even more wavelengths than the big professional units. Because when you try to mimic the sun, as many wavelengths that you can add, the better.

Nick Urban [00:13:49]:
Yeah, I kind of view it as like a diet. If you look at foods, you wouldn’t say, okay, we’re just gonna eat these one or two foods and be maximally healthy. At least most people wouldn’t do that. But then you add some diversity and all of a sudden you have five, six, seven, hopefully a lot more than that foods in your diet. It’s a more well rounded diet. You’re offsetting the consequences of each particular food group in isolation so that you get the effects and you mitigate the downsides. To me, I can see that same thing applying to light therapy as well. It’s no longer just like isolated wavelength here and isolated wavelength there, but a harmonious package of them all.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:14:28]:
Yes. For example, the ideal way is to always have UV like you do in nature. And in nature, basically Even at noon, 4 to 5% will be UVA, 0.5 will be UVB, and around 55% will be infrared. So in nature, UV never comes without the infrared or blue light. It’s not bad by itself because it always comes with a lot of infrared and obviously at the right time of the day. So that’s why what we try to do with our devices is to try to give the UV, but in a natural way, because it’s always together with the right wavelengths of near infrared in comparison to, for example, the spurdy that’s isolated UV or any tanning bed that you go. Obviously you will have the benefits of the UVs, but it’s not in the natural way because the infrared is the one protecting your skin.

Nick Urban [00:15:30]:
So when people hear about light and particularly sunlight, the first thought that usually crosses their mind is, isn’t sunlight dangerous? Doesn’t this cause all kinds of diseases? Doesn’t it age me prematurely? And usually in that same sense, UVA or uvb, or just the broader bucket umbrella term of just ultraviolet light in general is described as the rationale, you said something a minute ago that’s very important. And then in nature you’re getting a full package. You’re not just getting uva, UVB shining directly at the body and exposing it to that, but you’re getting other wavelengths at the same time. And it’s pretty well known, at least in the, I guess, like light therapy circles, that early light exposure in the day can mitigate against some blue light exposure in the afternoon and even in the early evening, and help protect melatonin levels and sleep and everything. Why is it that UV is vilified and how do you bypass that? Like, I’m sure you get a lot of concern and, or complaints about custom from customers saying, hey, isn’t this what causes all the damage? Why are you putting this into your product?

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:16:43]:
Yes. Well, basically the story behind UV being demonized comes during the 1970s. Back then they did some, some experiments that basically they gave UV in high doses to rats without the infrared. And they found that that amount of UV could be basically potentiating cancer. So they took all of the big conclusions believing that UV was bad for you. But if you see how they made it, first of all, in nature you never get those high doses of uv. And if you do, there’s always with the infrared. And they did it to rats.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:17:25]:
And rats don’t have the melanin production as we do humans because we’re not nocturnals. We humans are designed to be basically working during daylight. So they took a lot of conclusion. And that’s where all the sun block industry came in. Like, the sun is bad for you, it can cause cancer. You should be avoidant, you should be putting all this over. But the studies during the last 20 years are turning all of that information on the other direction. One of the most famous studies was a study from Sweden in which they were trying to prove that people that took the son would have higher mortality rates, higher cancer.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:18:05]:
So they basically followed around 20,000 women for 20 years, something like that. And basically when they finally got the results, they were totally surprised because they found that women that were taking the sun had a reduction in mortality rates. And even women that smoke that took the sun were having better health than women that didn’t smoke but didn’t take the sun. So basically the headline is avoiding the sun is as dangerous as smoking. Just imagine that everybody knows that if you really want to die soon, smoke. But people don’t get taught that if you avoid the sun that you have a higher increase in mortality rate and risk because you actually need the sun for your body to, to work fine. So that’s where it all started. But now all of the studies are finally understanding better on how the benefits of sunlight.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:19:04]:
And even they’re now understanding that you can never replace the sun with a normal vitamin D, because vitamin D, it’s amazing. But that’s just one little part of all the health benefits you get when you get the sun. The metamin D does not produce the serotonin, the dopamine, does not influence your hormones, does not basically give the energy to your mitochondria, does not improve the nitric oxide that UVA does. So vitamin D, it’s just a small component on all of the benefits of sunlight.

Nick Urban [00:19:38]:
Totally. And also the vitamin D you get through supplementation is not in that active form as well. So your body has to actually go through another process to activate that vitamin D as well.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:19:49]:
Oh, yes. So they did research and they saw what happens after people stop taking vitamin D. And the vitamin D levels plummet super fast because it’s not in the sulpated form. But when you take sunlight, it can last for many months. It goes down super slow. So chemically speaking, it’s not the same. So nothing beats natural vitamin D. And also one interesting fact.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:20:15]:
For example, in the United States, around 30% of the population have gastrointestinal issues. That means that their gut is not working fine. And what happens when you take oral vitamin D? It goes through the drain. So that’s why a lot of the people that are buying our product are people that cannot raise their vitamin D levels when they take it orally. So they go back to seeking it naturally through their skin.

Nick Urban [00:20:40]:
Interesting. Yeah. And there’s a lot of variation in like the doses people take in vitamin D supplements. It’s like I’ve. I’ve seen and heard people using 50,000 IUs per day to get their levels up. And I think more common is like 5,000 to 10,000. But for some people, even 5,000 to 10,000 can be way too much. And like they need to do 1000 or 2000, depending on their, I guess, skin color and their amount of time they spend outside and genetics and bunch other factors.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:21:09]:
Yes. And in my opinion, vitamin D levels should be just a marker to see if you’re getting enough uvb, is you’re getting enough sunlight. Because if you just take it orally. I’m not against taking orally. I’m actually in myself do a combination of natural sunlight and oral vitamin D. But you should be just as a benchmark if you’re getting enough sunlight. And there’s one super nice story that we got from Gary from the Human Garage. I don’t know if you heard about them.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:21:43]:
Well, he told me that he went to England a couple of weeks ago and they did a blood test on him to see how he was doing. And they were surprised because basically he has not been taking oral vitamin D. And he’s been traveling the last month. And his numbers were 99 nanograms per deciliter. So they say, like you have the highest numbers. We’re measured. And the only thing is that he’s always traveling with the mitolux and using it every day.

Nick Urban [00:22:13]:
Interesting. Yeah, that’s. I hadn’t come across the research that the oral supplementation doesn’t last in the body, doesn’t persist the way the Natural exposure does. That’s really interesting because, like, that means if you’re supplementing it in the winter, you’re gonna, your levels are gonna fall off very quickly if you stop versus if you already have the natural buildup from lots of daytime exposure, you might get through the winter fine because it’s being. It’s going down much more slowly.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:22:39]:
Yeah. And also a lot of the benefits that are attributed to vitamin D. It’s actually not vitamin D, but other pathways that you get through sunlight. A lot of the benefits are actually caused by the infrared. And they thought that they were caused by uvb, for example, the nitric oxide. That’s not caused by vitamin D. So nothing beats taking sunlight and it’s free if you live in the right place.

Nick Urban [00:23:04]:
Yeah. And so some people, because I think it’s mainly skin color, they will not get enough vitamin D production even if they spend a lot of time outside. It’s actually not just skin color now I think about it. It’s also like geographical location, like where they are in the world. If they’re very, very far north, for example, they might not get as much UV and then not be able to produce as much vitamin D as a result. There’s. What other factors are there? And like, do you see this coming up very often that they can’t get enough, people can’t get enough through natural light exposure?

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:23:36]:
Well, basically, your skin color determines the amount of melanin. And the melanin is the one that’s protecting your body from the uvs. That means that if, for example, you’re living in Ireland and you’re a redhead, that means a Fitzpatrick type 1. You’ll need very little sunlight to get your vitamin D. Because that’s how we evolve humans evolving iron to be very fair color, so they’re more efficient at producing vitamin D. On the other hand, if you go to Africa and you see dark skin, you will need several hours of super intense sunlight to get the right level. That means that if, for example, an African American, you have a skin color that needs to be the equator taking hours of sunlight, but now you have them in an environment that’s not the natural for their skin tone. That means that they’re going to have more problems with the deficiency and sunlight.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:24:37]:
And if you see at the data in the United States, most of the cases of diabetes are Latinos or African Americans. And why is that? Because they have higher melanin, darker skin, you need more sunlight, but you’re not giving the sunlight. So the darker your skin color, the more you really need to be getting the UVs in order to have to have good health.

Nick Urban [00:25:01]:
Yeah. Melanin itself is a very fascinating substance. It could be an entire podcast episode about all the things it does. And there’s the speculation that that’s like one of the key differentiators that let humans become what we are today and like what it can do for us in terms of protection against different things and substances and foods and substances we can consume that help increase our melanin production and capacity. Peptides, lots of other stuff there. Well, I mean, why do you think melanin is interesting if you do?

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:25:33]:
Well, melanin, in my opinion, it’s just starting to be understood on the role it makes. And if you see most of the studies are super recent, basically melanin does not only protect from visible spectrum, but it also protects from the uv, but it also been proven to basically absorb any type of the electromagnetic spectrum. So it can be even protecting you from non native emf. That’s one thing. Also now it’s being proven that melanin can directly produce energy and hydrogen. So basically we’re a solar panel through different pathways. One would be the melanin, the other would be the mitochondria. So it’s super amazing because to me it sounds like science fiction that we’re just like plants.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:26:25]:
Plants are producing energy in one pathway and we’re producing another pathway, but we both need the sun in order to be healthy. Yeah.

Nick Urban [00:26:35]:
I came across the work of, I think it was Arturo Haynes a while back and he, I believe he’s the one who coined the concept of humans being photo heteroautotrophs, meaning that we can get some of our energetic requirements in the day. I think it’s only like 5%. It’s not a very large number for most people directly from solar exposure.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:27:00]:
Oh yes, totally. So we’re a solar panel. And also when we get sunlight, we naturally have less hunger. And that’s one of the benefits. And I’ve experienced it myself many times. One of the sports that I love doing, it’s paramotor. And when I’m out and I’m taking the sun, basically I don’t even have lunch because I don’t get hungry, because the more sun that I have, the less hungry I am. And when I’m staying indoors for many hours, I just start getting hungry all of the time.

Nick Urban [00:27:29]:
Yeah, I think that’s working on the Pom C neurons in the brain, similar to the GLP1 drugs like Ozempic too.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:27:36]:
Oh, yeah. Now some of the pathways that they’re using. Basically, they’re recreating what sunlight does to create many drugs like the GLPs, or even there are some autoimmune drugs that basically what they do is that they mimic what sunlight is doing. That’s why a lot of the skin issues, they’re treated by getting UV on your skin. So they’re just replicating the same pathways you naturally get with sunlight.

Nick Urban [00:28:06]:
Well, I’d be remiss to circle back to the conversation about UV and ask you. Everyone knows that person who’s been in the sun all hours of the day, 12 hours a day, they look older. And it could be a correlation with other things as well. But if the sun and the other wavelengths Are really indeed as protective as they theoretically could be, why are we seeing accelerated, like, photo aging from excess exposure or what I deem to be excess exposure to the sun?

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:28:37]:
Okay, yes, it’s many different factors. For example, naturally we would wake with sunrise. We would be probably working outside, taking a lot of the near infrared. And that will be basically protecting our skin for the rest of the day. Because the near infrared will be protecting. Then you will naturally start getting the UVAs that will basically be generating more melanin. So when you finally got to noon, you already have a big biological protection against the UVBs. But what happens now? People spend most of the time inside, and maybe on the vacations, they go out and over burn and overtake the sun when they’re not ready.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:29:19]:
So that’s one of the causes. Other of the causes, it’s filtered sunlight. So, for example, if you’re driving, if you’re driving, people say, or you can even see it in pilots. Pilots age a lot faster than anyone. And one of the reasons, it’s because of the filtered sunlight. If you take a measurement from sunlight when it passes through windows, you’ll see that basically 100% of the UVB, it’s taken out, most of the UVA is still there. But also the infrared goes down. And the light that goes through the easiest is the blue light.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:29:56]:
So what’s happening? You’re taking out the natural protection of the UVB and of the infrared. So that’s like the perfect recipe for age in your skin Faster or right now, basically, we’re spending a lot of time indoors With a lot of blue light and a lot of blue light without of the near infrared. That’s basically aging your skin. It’s also causing wrinkles. It’s also causing skin patches and discoloration. So in nature, you need to take sunlight the right way. But obviously it’s proven that sunlight has a lot of benefits. But the UVAs do cause some skin aging.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:30:34]:
But you can balance that. Taking more early morning sunlight. Or getting a panel that has more infrared basically to reverse that part.

Nick Urban [00:30:43]:
Interesting. Yeah, I forgot about the relationship between UVA and UVB also. And that when you put light through a window, you’re filtering out the uvb. Which in a way counteracts some of the effects of uva. And it also gives you warning signs about like, your level of sun exposure. Like you get the reddening of the skin. And you get some of like the other things that help offset it.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:31:06]:
Yes, UVB is very delicate. So it doesn’t go to normal glass. That’s for example, with the Mitolux, we use a special quartz glass. Because that doesn’t disturb the uvb. So if we just put our chips to other panels. You couldn’t measure the UVB because they use the regular glass. So handling uvb, it’s a lot more delicate because it’s super easily filtered. And yes, UVB is actually your protection against skin aging.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:31:37]:
Because it’s the one that produces the melanin. So just getting uva, it’s what causes the aging. And one interesting fact, the sunscreens that were popular during the 1970s, 80s and 90s were just blocking UVB. So imagine this is the recipe for disaster. Because UVB is the one that protects. Obviously, if you get too much, you can get your skin burned. But what was happening, people were putting these sunscreens that were blocking all of the UVB. So now suddenly they were spending 5, 10, 15 times longer in the sun.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:32:13]:
But they were getting excessive UVA because they were not full spectrum sunblocks. So that was causing the accelerated aging. Because they were getting more UVA that they could naturally be getting. And they were getting it without the uvb. So that’s why sunbeds, or just using sunscreen that’s not full spectrum. Will actually cause your skin to age faster.

Nick Urban [00:32:39]:
Interesting. So are the sunscreens these days regulated in terms of like, I know spf, it used to refer to. I think it’s the ability to block uvb.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:32:49]:
Specifically sun protection factor.

Nick Urban [00:32:52]:
Yes.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:32:53]:
So they’re regulated, but depends on the country. The good thing that at least nowadays they’re full spectrum. That means that they’re also blocking the UVAs, but a lot of the chemicals. For example, one sunscreen that is legal in the US would probably be banned in Europe or in Australia. And sometimes they just change One chemical that has been proven to be dangerous for another chemical that will be proven to be dangerous and remove in five years. So my advice is the best sunscreen is the shade. So get enough light till you get your sunlight and then cover. And if you have to use sunscreen, I use mineral based.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:33:36]:
And nowadays there are minerals that are full spectrum. So that can actually protect not just from burning, but from aging.

Nick Urban [00:33:43]:
Yeah, I was curious about that because a lot of times you’ll see like these marketing claims in bottles and you don’t know if they actually mean anything, if they’re regulated, anyone oversees them. I know when I was younger, I used to use sunscreen and I would reapply it every 60 minutes or whatever the bottle said on it. And at the end of the day I was like, okay, I did this thing exactly by the books, the way it should be. But I would look at my skin and I’d be like, I look noticeably older. I shouldn’t look like this if I’ve really been fully protected in the sun all day, lo and behold, I wasn’t. And I did get photo aging and then I stopped using it and I, I would actually start to get red and I could tell when I was in the sun for too long and I’d slowly build up my solar callus over time and I’d spend more time in the shade. Because even in the shade, as I understand it, especially when you’re around a green environment, meaning like nature and stuff, the infrared reflects off the green and you get a greater exposure even though you’re not directly in the light of the sun. Yes.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:34:36]:
And another thing is that we’ve been doing things backward. One of the things that we do is if we go out, we put the sunglasses and basically we’re blocking the UVAs from entering the eye because we were taught that the UVAs were going to be causing cataracts. But what we’re basically doing is that we’re fooling our circadian rhythm. And that means that if we don’t detect the UVAs through your eyes, you’re not going to be producing as much melanin. So, for example, now I no longer use sunglasses. I use these glasses from the brand that’s Viva Rays. And what’s the benefit? It doesn’t block UVAs. That means that when I’m out, I’m getting full spectrum light.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:35:19]:
They do block uvb, so they’re not made through quartz. So that would be probably a second generation of the glasses. But at least they letting the UVA in and that’s amazing because you need that for your circadian rhythm and you need that to tell your brain to start producing melanin. So if you wear sunglasses, you will have an easier time burning your skin because your eyes will believe that you’re indoors, but your skin will be outdoors getting the sun.

Nick Urban [00:35:46]:
So are there exceptions? Would you wear like full protection sunglasses if you were like, say, in snow or you’re on a boat in really strong sunlight for a while? Where’s the threshold for you?

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:35:57]:
Oh, yeah, obviously, if you have too much light, like snow or on a boat, put the glasses. But try to avoid the glasses whenever there’s not that much light. But, but yes, polarized glasses are an amazing thing, but not for everyday use. So try to get a. And even in my case, when I first came with an optimization, I love doing morning walks and I get my glasses off to get the full spectrum through my eyes.

Nick Urban [00:36:25]:
Yeah, I do that same thing. I try and refrain from sunglasses as much as possible unless I’m in a very harsh climate that warrants their use. I’ve also heard some doctors saying that like, not wearing glasses predisposes you to cataracts and stuff like that. Other conditions that you don’t want. What have you seen in the research there?

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:36:44]:
Basically, the research says the opposite, that getting the sun does not affect cataracts, but avoiding natural light through your eyes causes myopia and also macular degeneration and obviously circadian rhythm dysfunction. So you need to get natural light. And they did a study in Japan, I believe, and they compared how the development of myopia in kids at school, and basically the ones that were getting more UVA because they had more natural light, so not an indoor environment, had probably like 70% less myopia than the ones that were just indoors with the LEDs. So the artificial LEDs we’re using nowadays, if you don’t combine it with natural sunlight, that’s the perfect recipe for getting myopia and other eye problems. So full spectrum sunlight is the solution. Or in my case, for example, when I turn on the mitre, looks like right now in the fireplace, at least I’m balancing the near infrared so there’s not an excess of blue light by itself.

Nick Urban [00:37:54]:
So look, the three real solutions that I see here from what you just said, first of all, get actual real light without any impedance, any blocking. So take the sunglasses off, at least for your morning walk. Then also swapping out the LEDs. And if you can’t do that, then and. Or add in a firelight kind of thing where you’re getting a fireplace light, where you’re getting some of the infrared added back into your light exposure.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:38:21]:
Oh, yes, totally. So the idea with our panel is to try to give you the benefits of sunlight in different times of the day. One thing that I recommend to people, the people that buy our product, is like, have your morning routine, take a shower, and then use the Mitolux for four to seven minutes, depending on your skin color. And you’ll have your dose of of UVBs to produce the vitamin D and all of the other benefits. Then you can use the mitolux at night in the healing mode for anti aging. So you don’t need to buy a mask, but you could be getting all of these benefits. And I use the fireplace myself when I’m reading or watching TV or here in my home office to balance the excessive blue light.

Nick Urban [00:39:08]:
Interesting. Okay, so when I use your light, I sometimes will run healing mode for a while and then I’ll go to the UV mode or the full spectrum mode where it contains uv. Is that unnecessary? Like, how does the actual UV program work? Because as you made it very clear, the research shows you don’t want to just take the isolated wavelengths of UVA and UVB and just blast them. You want to actually make sure you’re getting prior or proper exposure to infrared. I’m not sure if it needs to be before or if it’s fine if it comes after or ideally both.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:39:39]:
Okay, well, basically, now that you mentioned, there’s one secret behind the development of our product, but you can read it in the manual. So actually it’s not that secret at all. But when you use, for example, the P3 and you turn it on, it’s five minutes. So that means that that’s the program that somebody that’s a Fitzpatrick type three should be using. But also that means that you only have three of the five minutes with uvs. So actually it’s like a mini sun cycle. The first minute it’s just red and infrared priming your skin so it will be ready for the uvs. And, and then you gradually increase the uvs with the red near infrared.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:40:18]:
And at the end you have one minute or more, depending on the program, with just the near infrared. So we took that in mind to have a mini sun cycle. But obviously if you have the time to use the healing mode before or after, that’s even better because you’ll be getting more infrared.

Nick Urban [00:40:34]:
Interesting. So what you would not want to do is go UV mode, set it to 5 minutes for type 3 and then turn it off after a minute or so because you wouldn’t be getting any of the actual uv.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:40:46]:
It’s actually all of the time. When it has uv, it also has the near infrared. So it’s better to have the full program because you will be getting more infrared. But at all times, when there’s uv, there’s the red and the near infrared. And we also have something very interesting. The wavelengths we had added not by chance, but through, for example, the 590, that’s the orange one. We chose it because that’s one of the ones that shows that prevents skin redness and also reverses skin photo aging. So that’s the orange one.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:41:21]:
Also on this generation, we also added the 940 nanometer wavelength that just a few companies are using. And that’s because the 940, it’s the one that prevents your skin from getting burned.

Nick Urban [00:41:34]:
So.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:41:35]:
So actually when you get the near infrared, your tolerance for Ub can double or even triple when you’re added with the near infrared. So just by adding the 940, you can get even twice as much UV. That means more vitamin D production without getting burned.

Nick Urban [00:41:52]:
So that’s one thing that people don’t talk about in the light therapy world. It’s like, what do these other amber hue lights do? What is 940 infrared? Is that near infrared still? What does that do? And it’s cool to hear that you guys are actually building out that. Not necessarily research, but you’re compiling it and synthesizing it into the products themselves.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:42:13]:
Oh yes. Basically all of the features in our lamps are based on scientific studies that are published. And then we’re learning. So on the first generation, we didn’t have the 940 or we didn’t have the 810. We had the 830 and 850. But then we learned about the benefits of 810, mostly for deep penetration for people that are doing sports, because it penetrates good for muscle recovery. And the 940, it’s mostly added because it can help protect your skin from the uvs. So on the mitolux you have seven wavelengths.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:42:52]:
So it’s super broad spectrum comparing to anything on the market.

Nick Urban [00:42:57]:
And also I know from looking into this a long time ago when I was going to build out my own panels, because I had a phase where I thought that would be an easy thing to do. And then I realized it’s actually a lot harder than it seems getting all the materials and soldering everything Together, wiring it, getting the driver and everything decided not to do that. But the different diodes are very different prices. And I think like the 850 in terms of like the near infrared, I think that’s like one of the more affordable ones compared to some of the other lower like 8108-108208-30840, I think those are a bit more expensive and harder to source.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:43:31]:
Oh yes. And for example, in our products the biggest cost that we have is the 295 nanometer UVB that’s like 8 times more expensive than the normal near infrared. So there’s even one company that’s selling a device that uses the, the 295 like ours and instead of being $800 they’re charging around 4 to 5k. So the UVB can be very expensive. But we try to make the devices for home use so everybody can get them. But yes, there’s a very different price range depending on the, on the wavelength. And 850, it’s the most popular one. So it’s the, it’s the cheaper one.

Nick Urban [00:44:14]:
Gotcha. Let’s dig a little more into the UV now because that’s a really important part of these products and I think there’s not much information out there in the public domain unless you actually dive into the research around these about like what to look for, how you know you’re getting a good UV containing product. As as you mentioned, there’s the Spurdy, which is the old legacy established one, but it uses different technology, it’s not led, has plenty of other downsides and issues like first of all like how do you even choose between the many UV like LED wavelengths and everything? Because there’s the one that you guys chose, there’s another one I’ve seen other companies use and there’s differences between each.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:44:54]:
Yes, basically right now the wavelength that had been used more is the 310, 311 wavelength and they are using it a lot right now for skin issues, for autoimmune like eczema, psoriasis, vitiligo, that’s the one they use. So it’s very good for skin issues, but it’s not the best for vitamin D production. We chose the 295 because there’s a study that basically used different wavelengths of UVB to see what was the most efficient at producing vitamin D. So it’s the 295. So that means that you, it need to take it around four times less exposure than the 310 to get the same benefits in the vitamin D production. So the 295 has more energy, so it has more potential to get in your burn, but at the same time, you will need to use it less. So that’s where it compensates. So that’s why we choose the 295.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:45:57]:
And yeah, it’s incredible at building, especially in small devices, that you cannot add that many watts of power. Getting the most efficient wavelength is the best and also takes less time to get the same benefits.

Nick Urban [00:46:13]:
I think that’s important because it’s easy to hear that, okay, this other wavelength is safer because it is less, I guess, less dangerous. It causes fewer side effects and it’s less mutagenic and whatever. But then if you have to use that for a longer time frame to get the same benefits, is it really any safer? Or in fact, is that actually more dangerous because you have a total, higher. Total exposure? So it’s interesting to hear how you guys chose that and it makes sense.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:46:40]:
Yes. And basically, the device has a lot of power, but you just use it for three to five minutes. So in contrast with what people do when they take the sun, since they’re not taking the sun every day, when they finally do, they spend too much in the sun and they’re getting burned. So. So that’s what you need to avoid the philosophy of our product. It’s small doses, but in a consistent manner. So if you follow instructions, you have a zero chance of getting burned because it’s just a little dose. But when you take it through time and do it every day, that’s when you start building all of the results.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:47:17]:
And one of the things that we’re the only company to be using, in the Mitalux model, we also added a distance sensor. And we did that because I was reading always when I do a product, I read the reviews of the competition. So some of the people that were using the Spurdy were getting burned, and it was not Spurdy’s fault. But a lot of times people don’t read the instructions and just go and put it over and they were misusing it. So we did the programs because it’s easier than choosing minutes. Just choose your Fitzpatrick and it will be balanced for that. But also the distance sensor prevents people from getting too close and getting burned. So it’s a safety feature.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:48:01]:
So it’s designed that if you get closer than 12, 13 inches, it will beep and it will pause and it will just continue giving you the red and near infrared. So by doing that, we prevent People that just plug the device on to be possibly getting a burn. Because UVB can burn. Yeah.

Nick Urban [00:48:20]:
And you’re also calculating the dose based on a particular distance. And if you go way closer or way farther away, then you’re going to be getting different results. And so what I’ve been doing is I will go to, I’ll find where the sensor says I should go and then I’ll back off a little bit, a little bit from there. Is that a good approach?

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:48:38]:
That’s the best approach because even the spurt is designed for 15 inches. We design for 15 inches. And the sensor will pass the unit at 12. So basically get close and when it starts beeping, just move three, two, three inches away. And that’s the sweet spot. And that’s the beautiful thing because it helps you have the same dose every day so you won’t have any surprises. And basically you start with a P3, for example, in your case. But that doesn’t mean that that’s the end point for safety.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:49:10]:
That’s your starting point. But probably next week you can go to P4 and you test your skin if you’re not getting to red, and then you keep going up until you find the sweet spot. The sweet spot in Caucasian basically is when you get a little pink because there’s also a curve for vitamin D production. So if you burn, actually you’re reversing the production of vitamin D. So you just need to get the right amount to have the, the best efficiency at.

Nick Urban [00:49:36]:
Producing vitamin D. Yeah, you also cause inflammation. You’ll have, you’ll force your body to actually repair excess exposure to begin with. So it doesn’t make sense, especially when you, if you plan on going outside later in the day as well.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:49:49]:
Oh, yes, totally. So it’s all about consistency, it’s all about getting the right dose to see the result. And usually either by taking sunlight or using our product, you could see a measurable number on your vitamin D level from month number one. And usually within three months you can go from deficiency to at least normal levels. But if you keep using it every day, it will just keep rising. And we also have stories of people that were taking oral vitamin D and couldn’t raise their levels more. But when they combine it with our product, they finally got their levels raising 20 more points.

Nick Urban [00:50:31]:
Interesting.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:50:32]:
Okay.

Nick Urban [00:50:33]:
And when I use it, I usually target my chest area without a shirt on. Should I be rotating it, like doing my chest today, my back tomorrow, or does it not really matter?

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:50:43]:
Your skin is your skin. So basically you could do that you’ll still be producing the same amount. But if you want to produce twice, then you can use it once in your chest and once in your back.

Nick Urban [00:50:56]:
So it’s safe to have multiple exposures like that. Are you saying on the same day or different days?

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:51:00]:
I recommend just one exposure a day on the same area, but you can expose different areas of your body. And as I told you, the, the P3 for your skin type is just the base point. But probably if you next week you can raise it to be for one month, later you can raise it to be five because you’re going to be building your solar kettle. That means that the more you use it, the less efficient your skin will be at producing vitamin D because you will be having more melanin. But having more melanin is actually healthy.

Nick Urban [00:51:32]:
Yeah. And so the way it looks is it doesn’t look like it’s covering my full body because I’m six foot three, so pretty tall and it’s like, obviously not lay up my entire body. But because of the way that vitamin D production works and exposure works to uvb, it’s going to have systemic effects. It’s not like I’m only going to get increased vitamin D in this tight, in this portion of my chest. It’s going to be like systemic.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:51:54]:
Oh yeah. Chest is basically a 25% coverage of your body. So that’s good enough to have good vitamin D production because if your jaw, if you’re wearing clothes, just your arms and your face, that’s just a 10% part of your body. So it’s not practical to get your vitamin D if you’re wearing clothes. So the best actual way to get vitamin D would be just to be completely naked laying down at the midday sun. And that’s where you will get in because you have the biggest area of your body. But, but just using it on your chest, it’s good enough to be producing around 3,000. I use of vitamin D in one session and then does it matter when.

Nick Urban [00:52:35]:
I do this session? Like I’d assume if I wanted to make it match what normal exposure would be, ideally midday sometime because that’s when UV is high, naturally highest. But do you see good results from using it? For example, in the morning, I’m not sure about UVB in the evening, yes, definitely.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:52:53]:
It varies between people. I’ve seen some people that write us and say us like I use it at night but I got an energy boost and sometimes that’s what you don’t want to get at night. So that’s A great thing. Imagine a product with light that gives you more energy, but also the best thing is just to sync it up with your circadian rhythm. That means I recommend that using it during daytime, best in the morning or at noon. And if you’re going to use the device at night, use the healing mode that doesn’t have any uv, so you align better with your circadian rhythm instead of disrupting it.

Nick Urban [00:53:32]:
Okay, simple enough. There’s so many cool things to discuss about this technology.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:53:38]:
Oh, yes, and a lot of the benefits of ubb, because UBB has tons of benefit. So when I started, for me, it was testosterone and mood. Those were the two things that I was looking. But there’s a lot more to that. One would be autoimmune function. And that’s one heavy topic in most of the world right now, because I believe around 10% of the population has autoimmune disease. So one of the best ways to help with that is to get more sunlight. And just as simple as that.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:54:14]:
And even if you go back on time, one of the first recorded benefits or medical recommendations about taking sunlight was actually the skin. And they say the Greeks were recommending if you have any skin issues, go take more sun. And that suddenly, even today, you see that they’re manufacturing some lamps for helping you protect or reverse acne. And they’re using some wavelengths of blue light in combination with red and near infrared. So if you have pimples, go take more sun and they will naturally go down.

Nick Urban [00:54:50]:
What do you think is like the most underutilized use case for these lamps?

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:54:57]:
I believe that the most underused is that most of these lamps, they’re just used for beauty when the near infrared can do a lot more. In my case, whenever I am feeling any joint issues, because I went back to the gym some months ago and my joints were hurting, I just started using more red light therapy. And you could feel the benefit from day number one. So it’s not just for the skin, it’s for a lot more. And the more you study, the more you’ll realize how it could be improving your life in so many different pathways.

Nick Urban [00:55:38]:
How did you choose to not include UVA in the lamps?

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:55:42]:
Well, basically, this product was designed to be given as many benefits as possible. But when we did our studies, a lot of people’s concern was skin aging. So basically they wanted the benefits of sunlight in regards to the uvb. That means the hormones and the vitamin D. But they were afraid of the skin aging. And most of the skin aging is caused by the UVAs so basically we decided not to include the UVAS in that sense, but we’ll probably be launching soon some other models that will be including uva because some people just want the benefits and they don’t care about the skin aging. So one of the benefits is nitric oxide. And nitric oxide, to me it’s one of the most miracle molecules ever.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:56:38]:
I’ve tried lots of supplements and to me, one of the supplements that I used around 20 years ago for the first time was arginine alpha ketoglutarate. And the benefit of that is increasing your nitric oxide. And I was basically recovering twice as fast when going to the gym. And arginine also helps you lower your blood pressure. And what it does is basically increases the nitric oxide. And you can also do that naturally when you take the sun or take UVAs. So that’s one of the biggest benefits. And we’ll probably use it on some other products in the future to try to mimic, as I said, natural sunlight even closer.

Nick Urban [00:57:23]:
Yeah, I was going to say, because even if it’s not like a high percentage of uva, like most of the light is still the other wavelengths, even just having like a trace amount in there could help with some of the effects you get from UVA that you don’t get from others like the nitric oxide. And there’s a handful of others that I came across when I was researching it as well. But then you have to juggle the whole public perception of like UVA being the devil, being like this terrible thing and having so many consequences and downsides without any benefit, even though it’s not necessarily true, but then figuring out how you can work that into a product without causing people to be even more concerned.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:58:02]:
Yes, the good thing about these lamps in regards to natural sunlight is that if you want the benefits but don’t want the wrinkle, for example, in a product that would have the uva, just shine it on your chest, just shine it on your back so you’ll still have incredibly young looking face, so you could still get the benefits.

Nick Urban [00:58:23]:
Yeah, that’s a great point. When I go out in the sun, I always try and wear a hat or something if it’s going to be after the early morning or late evening rays because that’s when UV is highest. And I can help keep my face looking a little bit younger than if I was to not wear a hat. So it’s a good tip that if you’re going to apply UV to the body in other ways or full spectrum light Then contains UV that just don’t put it on your face or areas that you don’t want to look perhaps a little bit older.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:58:52]:
Yes. And for example, what I do when I take my sunbeds, I do it here in my house and I do them naked because better coverage. And you also want to be getting the UVs and the near infrared on your genitals because that helps a lot. The Lapdic cells get benefit from getting the near infrared so you having a healthier testosterone production and also fertility. But what I do is that I use mineral sunscreen on my hands, on my neck and on my face. So that’s what I do. So I get full benefits, but I don’t get the aging on the parts that usually age faster. That would be your hands, neck and face.

Gerardo Gutierrez [00:59:40]:
That’s the way I do it. So I do use mineral sunscreen, but targeted not on my whole body.

Nick Urban [00:59:47]:
Interesting. One of the theories that I had and I’ve been using consistently is that for maybe 15 seconds or so during the session that I’m using the mito luxe lamps, I will take it and I’ll shine it far lower and I’m already naked, so it’s fine. And I’d assume that’s going to further increase testosterone production and have other beneficial effects. Is 15 seconds, would that have any effect? And I don’t know if there’s any research on whether or not that would do anything.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:00:17]:
Well, there’s research, recent research on the effects of infrared on male genitals at improving sperm function. So the mobility and the quality. And that’s because the cells that are producing the sperm obviously have a mitochondria. Also sperm are one of the most dense mitochondria cells in the body as they exhale. So the more near infrared you get, the more chances you have at producing quality sperm and your fertility. So there’s research on that. But the only research we have on the ub on your genitals is from 1939. And basically they saw an increase of 300% of a prohormone that goes in the production of testosterone.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:01:09]:
So it’s not actually testosterone, but other hormone. But yeah, there needs to be more recent studies regarding that. But I would recommend basically to try to do a full cycle down under if you want to see the benefit. But even if you use it in any part of the body, you will feel the increase in libido because of the uva. Cool.

Nick Urban [01:01:33]:
I did not realize that.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:01:35]:
And also one thing that I try to mention, people is that one of the best indicators of your health is your libido. Because when do you have your highest libido? Basically when you’re a teenager that means that your hormones and everything are doing great. And when you’re at my age, that libido has gone down. And when you’re 70 and one nice story that I love to tell, I gave my father one of the lamps and I told him just use it, it will help with your hair. I didn’t go and he calls me like three weeks later and he said, gerardo, I’m having a side effect with the lamp. And I thought like, wow, maybe he overused it and he got burned or something. And he said is that I’m having morning erections again. And that was his side effect.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:02:20]:
So I told him, like, you’re 81 years old, that’s a great side effect. Yeah, yeah.

Nick Urban [01:02:26]:
It’s a good indicator of improved overall health. Like you’re mentioning too.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:02:29]:
Yeah. So libido should be one of the best things to, to measure how your health is doing.

Nick Urban [01:02:35]:
One of the other questions I had for you is related to the glasses. So you don’t want to look directly at UVP for long periods of time, especially when it’s really intense. Is that more of like a requirement? Like you’re going to go blind within one session if you aren’t wearing the glasses. Like if I have my eyes closed, would that be okay? Would that be enough protection? Or like what if someone else walks in the room while I’m using it and they’re not like directly in front of it but they’re say 50ft away, 40ft away, 30ft away. Will they have eye damage from walking into the same room as the UVB enabled lamp?

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:03:10]:
Okay, well basically if you just close your eyes you won’t have any problem. And also if you are at 4 meters, the UVB will be basically non existent because light works in a, a quadratic function. So that means that if you Instead of being 15 inches, you’re 30 inches, you’ll just have one fourth of the exposure. And if you increase that distance you have 116 of the UVB. But we mostly do it so we’re protected against any person using it the wrong way. So obviously I use it many times without glasses. I’m just not looking at it directly and nothing bad happens. But even with a stove, if you put your hand on the stove, you’ll get burned, but that’s logical.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:03:59]:
So it’s just doing things the way you should use. But it’s just a Protection So nobody does anything wrong.

Nick Urban [01:04:07]:
Yeah, I figured. I just know that it’s playing with. When playing with UVA uvb, I want to be a little extra careful. And so if I am aware that it’s not like I’m not going to go blind in one session from taking the glasses off or forgetting the glasses or something, that’s just reassuring. But in general, of course it’s safer to use the glasses. And like some manufacturers will include glasses with devices that do not contain uva uvb. Just for red and infrared.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:04:34]:
For red and near infrared you don’t need it. Actually, actually it’s good for your health. They’ve been shown that just a three minute exposure with infrared can improve your the way that your eyes detect color and detect contrast. And it’s because your eyes are one of the most mitochondrion dense part of the body. So people believe that in one cell you have one mitochondria. But in one cell I believe that the egg cell has more than 15,000 mitochondria. In just one cell your eyes have like 4,000 hard muscle have also a lot of. And the only cells in your body that don’t have mitochondria are your red blood cells.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:05:17]:
So that means that most part of your body, when you shine the infrared, you could be really improving most cells.

Nick Urban [01:05:25]:
Yeah. And neurons have up to 2 million mitochondria per cell as well.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:05:31]:
Wow, I didn’t know that that was so much. And yes, and that’s why you see that there are some devices now like the ceratribe that my father is using and it’s a great product and it puts the 1064 nanometer because it has a deep penetration, because the skull is designed to receive sunlight. So part of your brain is receiving the near infrared. So imagine your brain is actually designed to be being nourished by the near infrared. And if you’re all day inside or if you’re wearing a hat, you’re not getting that infrared.

Nick Urban [01:06:06]:
Well, you do have a device in front of you that is capable of measuring the different wavelengths. And for people who are tuning into the video version, it’d be interesting to see what your light environment looks like now in terms of the spectrums and then what it looks like with light. The fire. Fireplace mode. I forget what it’s called. Yeah, fireplace mode. On.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:06:28]:
Yes. I’m going to show you because my light environment here is not that bad because I have here a special LEDs that have like full spectrum visible light. But just to give you an idea. So Most people environment will even be worse than I’m going to show. So this would be me pointing to the screen and this is what I’m getting here.

Nick Urban [01:06:50]:
Okay, we see a graph with big spikes of blue, little spikes in green and yellow and decent spikes in red. Is there infrared in that too?

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:07:00]:
No, zero infrared. But I’m going to turn this light so you get an idea of how actually the light environment is because this is a special light I use. So this is what you would be really getting. Okay, so this is.

Nick Urban [01:07:13]:
Oh wow. Huge spiking blue now and smaller spikes and everything else.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:07:18]:
Okay, so that’s what you’re getting. You’re not getting any infrared. The light is super bad quality. No infrared and also no violets and a spike in blue. And now I’m going to turn on the fireplace just a little bit and I’m going to do here is. And now I’m going to do this again. So you have a measurement and you’ll be surprised.

Nick Urban [01:07:43]:
Oh, wow. Is that almost entirely infrared and a tiny little spike of red and nothing else really even visible?

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:07:51]:
Yes. That means that the blue now it’s basically not even visible because the red orange is outpowering it. And that other spike that you see is the near infrared. So basically we turn a light environment with 0% infrared into a light environment with about 95% infrared and basically no most blue light. And I’m going to show you one other thing. There’s not even one device that can measure the whole spectrum. And since. So I’m going to show you because this is the mitolite, so the other has even more wavelengths.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:08:27]:
But I’m going to show you here that we even have wavelengths that most devices cannot measure. So on the other device we saw the 850, but we couldn’t see the 940. But using this device that staggered toward the near infrared. So you’re getting a lot of full spectrum light, but basically you’re harmonizing and neutralizing the bad environment that you have.

Nick Urban [01:08:52]:
And what happens if you turn the other light on while you keep fireplace on at the same time? How does, how does that, how does that change the overall.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:09:00]:
It will still, it will still be a great different. So this is alternate again, this is not that bad because this is a special led. You still have a blue spike, but you have a little red. But now if I turn the. In the fireplace mode, you’ll still be super surprised on the difference.

Nick Urban [01:09:21]:
Nice. Wow, that’s really impressive. I didn’t realize it was that dramatic of a difference. It looks almost exactly the same as when your main LED light for the video was off.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:09:31]:
Yeah. So this is one of the great benefits that you could have with either of our products. It’s a lamp that you could be using all day long. It doesn’t disturb your eyes. And basically you’re getting back the near infrared in your lives. And as I told you, we started by introducing the UVB and no other company was doing that. But now we also understood on all of the benefits of having near infrared. And not just one dose a day, but having it all day around.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:10:01]:
And with the infrared, you can use it while you’re working in front of your screen or you’re watching TV or reading. And as you see, it’s an incredible difference.

Nick Urban [01:10:14]:
Yeah, that is incredible. The final question I have for you about the technology itself is that I have these desktop devices. They can go on the desktop and they’re very portable, good for traveling and everything. How does the power come, like emission? The power output of these compare to like a device that is like, I guess, less portable. Like a full body device. Like am I going to get a therapeutic dose with just this one alone or would I have to use it like 24, 7 to get like a. Any noticeable overall effect?

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:10:47]:
Okay. Regarding UVB and vitamin D, our device is around 9 to 15 times stronger than the sun. That means that in just five minutes and just with your chest area, you’re covered with all the UVB that you need for the rest of the day. So even if you had a big panel, what I would be doing is lowering the distribution of uvb. So I wouldn’t. Basically a panel that’s five times bigger, I wouldn’t increase the UVB five times because you have more area. So it would be better to distribute. To distribute that.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:11:22]:
Regarding the red and the near infrared, obviously the bigger your panel, the better. So what I do in my room, I have a big panel that’s just infrared. And I combine it with the mitolux. But that’s if you want like full body. But one of those panels, you cannot bring it with you. So that’s one of the beauty. And actually one panel. I bought a big panel for my father, half body, and he gave it back because he said, like, I don’t have the space, I don’t like how it is.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:11:52]:
So the idea with the Metallux is to have a panel that’s strong enough to give you results, but doesn’t take space. And you can take it with you wherever you’re traveling. For example, just imagine this is giving you all that power. It’s just 2.5 pounds, and you can take it with you. So that’s. For most people, that would be a better solution than a big panel.

Nick Urban [01:12:18]:
And so if I have a big panel, let’s say I spend 15 minutes in front of it. Could I use the either of the two desktop models and put that there, take my shirt off, work for an hour instead of like the 10 or 15 minutes and set it in front of a big panel and be getting, like, still like a therapeutic amount of, like, red and.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:12:36]:
Oh, yeah, yeah. Basically one small lamp. If you move it farther away, you’ll have less light, but you can definitely use it if you just put the healing mode, one hour and do a workout there. And you’ll be getting a lot of the red light therapy because you’ll be supplementing it with longer exposure time.

Nick Urban [01:12:58]:
Okay. Yeah. And so for the red light therapy and infrared therapy benefits, there’s obviously certain things that are going to be, like, systemic effects, like, for example, offsetting the effects of blue light and other forms of light. Are you also going to be getting specific, like, spot targeting, local effects, like, say, if I shine it on my hand, where I’d be getting, like, a unique treatment in my hand, but not necessarily like my stomach.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:13:23]:
They did a study and they basically were shining one side of the face with the red near infrared to see how it compared to the other side. And they noticed that obviously the best improvement you got from the side that was getting the red near infrared, but they were surprised to see that they were also getting some benefits on the area that was not receiving the red and near infrared. So there’s even not as great as with vitamin D, because that goes into your bloodstream, but there’s a systemic effect that when you get near infrared, that translates to all the rest of your body. And you need to know that what’s happening is that mitochondria are. And the cells are communicating with each other. So when you get a biological reaction in one part of your body, that will translate for the rest. But if you have, like, a localized arthritis, obviously the more that you use it in a localized area, the more benefits you will get in that. That place.

Nick Urban [01:14:22]:
Wow. Well, Gerardo, thank you so much for sharing all this. I’ve gained a ton of wisdom. And unlike so many other companies I know in this space who are just like, adding WI fi connectability to their devices and things that aren’t really moving the needle much, you’re actually doing a lot of cool stuff, including like the dynamically color, the dynamically changing light modes, the wavelengths throughout the sessions and adding a bunch of different wavelengths and more. And most closely mimicking actual natural light and having the candle mode. We didn’t even touch on the gamma mode which can train your brain to different frequencies. There’s so many cool things that these devices do that none of my other panels do. So if people want to give them a shot to try out any of the Mitolux products, how do they connect with you and find you?

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:15:08]:
Yes, I’m going to share you a special code. So they get a 10% discount if they want to purchase a device. And they can Visit [email protected] and if they have any questions, we’re super happy to answer. You can write us to through our social media too and we’ll always happy to help answering your questions whether you buy or not.

Nick Urban [01:15:32]:
Sure, sounds good. And the code I have for you guys already I think is urban, so you guys can use that if you want to check them out. And you have currently two models. You have the light lamp, this portable one great for travel and you have the more hearty desktop. I mean they’re both desktop, but this one has more features built into it and more modes and everything. Any other differentiators that people should know about before they decide on a product?

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:15:58]:
Basically consider one is the MacBook Pro and the other is the MacBook. So they give most of the benefits. The main difference between the more expensive model is is one is made with aluminum, the other is painted steel. The premium model has the distance sensor and the premium model has the Gamma mode and also more wavelengths. But both will give you incredible effects. And the Orange one is 40% cheaper. So it’s just for people could have and because a lot of our customers were like saying I love the Mitre looks but I want something that would be under the $500 mark. So we did it because our vision is not to have our products in biohackers houses, but in every household because we need to get more sunlight and our slogan is get your daily dose of sunshine.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:16:50]:
And we’re trying to lower our prices and keep the quality so we can make it more affordable for everyone.

Nick Urban [01:16:58]:
Beautiful. Well, thank you so much Kuti for accomplishing this and sharing your creation with the world.

Gerardo Gutierrez [01:17:05]:
Thank you so much and I’ll keep you posted on all the new products and ideas we have.

Nick Urban [01:17:11]:
And thank you all for sharing your time, your energy with us. Until next time, be an outlier. Thanks for tuning in to high performance longevity if you got value today, the best way to support the show is to leave a review or share it with someone who’s ready to upgrade their healthspan. You can find all the episodes, show notes and resources [email protected] until next time, stay energized, stay bioharmonized, and be an outlier.